We are still interested in application conformance and some form of testing to enable ISVs and developers to know that the s/w they build really does conform. Furthermore, we wish our purchasers to know that when they purchase an application they can know with some confidence that 1) The application is not overly tied to a particular platform, 2) That the purchasers are not overly tied to the vendor of the application (especially in the NHS, we have many small vendors who will not be in business as long as the NHS), 3) that the application will fit within information management and technology strategies, and will demonstrate VFM over a period when the platform required to run the s/w may change. In the vast majority of cases NHS organisations do not have the cash to replace a single application (and the platform that supports it) in one go, let alone replace a whole hospital IT system in one go. This means that we must buy a steady amount of replacement platform/application each financial year, that is within budegtary limits, and fits within an overall strategy for continuous replacement. A strategy such as this requires standards (and also matches the client/server model well). The area is too complex for the word of the developer to be taken. Applications require testing just as platforms do. Openness is about value for money and reduction of risk, not technology, standards, testing, etc. But to demonstrate VFM and to really reduce the risk to a purchaser testing must be available on both sides of the API equation (platform and application). Application testing itself is a complex issue, and one that I do not think is solvable thru' 2nd or 3rd party testing. There are too many applications (in different configurations on different operating systems) to test in this way. Further, applications really require testing for standards conformance as part of the development cycle. This indicates that the only reasonable route to application conformance testing is thru' 1st party testing. The conformance test software needs to be available on an fair basis to all ISVs and developers. For example, in the NHS we have many very small ISVs (employing maybe less than 5-10 people). In the majority of these cases the NHS is the only customer and they may be one of only two or three (suppliers of that software). ISVs of this type could not pay the fees associated with most conformance s/w (cf: Single UNIX spec test s/w, POSIX test bench s/w , etc) and would not. We do not want an application conformance regime that favours the big ISV vendors over the small ISVs for no reasons except their respective bank balance. This creates a diffcult situation. We want a fair and equitable testing arrangement that is available to all developers and doesn't cost so much that it will cost small ISVs out of the market. Perhaps there is a soultion based on testing "houses", set up on the Internet, with cost associated with membership and/or a charge per test run. But, there is a difficulty here. How many ISVs do you know that would be willing to send their source code over the Internet to be tested by someone else and then trust them to delete all copies of the source sent to them (and not read it while it is being tested and not leak it anywhere). Not many, I think is the answer. Whatever model is chosen for conformance testing it must be confidential and secure, until the software has been published with its brand. ISVs must be confident that the process is trustworthy. As a user organisation, most of our IT investment is tied up in components upwards from the operating system (i.e. DB, application, application interoperability, people, etc). It therefore makes sense to be concerned about ensuring the best VFM and least potential risk when investing in these areas. This leads to a requirement to be able to demonstrate to the satisfaction of all parties involved that the best VFM and least risk options, that fit within the IM&T strategy of the purchasing organisation, have been selected. Hope some of this has been useful, - Rob Smith.